Author Topic: Friends of Bill Z.  (Read 489 times)

longtail

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Friends of Bill Z.
« on: December 04, 2016, 09:57:58 AM »
I once had the experience of having to accompany a girlfriend to court ordered 12 step meetings.  What I learned from this is that American addict culture subscribes to the notion that addicts are powerless against their addiction without the intervention of a "higher power", and that our judiciary feels it is ok to order you to go to a religious meeting once you get involved in our legal system over drugs or alcohol. ( Sitting in court observing, one day, I did see a man simply tell the judge he'd rather do the jail time and be done with it, so as not to have to keep reporting to a court appointed officer about meeting attendance; I felt a certain respect for this attitude. )
   I myself was addicted to opioid analgesics for some years, although I managed to avoid the legal system.  I was able to quit with help from a doctor, and a lot of disgust for something that put me at the mercy of unscrupulous dealers; pride and wrath got me clean, not an imaginary friend. I don't believe in  the "once an addict, always an addict" line, nor that addiction is any excuse for other criminal behaviour such as stealing. Now, I still enjoy brewing and drinking beer... for the most part, I consume this in reasonable quantities, and don't seem to have any inclination to let it rule me.
   So I had a random thought, "what would a Satanic substance abuse group look like?"  Perhaps the very idea of addiction is anti-Satanic? Yet humans do have the tendency to seek pleasure in many and various ways, some of which may result in individuals feeling that they have an issue overdoing something, and that they need help or support to escape it. Peer pressure can be a useful tool! Perhaps a virtual place like an IRC channel... "the Bill Z. Pub" . *Grin*
    Anyway, I'm not really proposing to start something like this, I'm mostly just curious about other people's thoughts on the topic, and wanted to kick this idea around a bit. 
 
Joyfully, Non Serviam

Mordred

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Re: Friends of Bill Z.
« Reply #1 on: December 05, 2016, 06:26:32 AM »
I'm somewhat familiar with the 12-step program due to being in a treatment facility with some people who were/are alcoholics. From what I recall, AA meetings don't center around any specific religion. The "higher power" they talk about seems open to interpretation. I get how a Satanist wouldn't want to subscribe to the idea of anything being above him/her, but if you have to fool yourself into believing something like that in order to kick a habit (if the ends justify the means in other words) and you can simply utilize spiritual or religious principles for the duration of getting off of a harmful substance, then ditch said principles when they no longer suit you, I see nothing "anti-Satanic" about it at all. Not everyone has the willpower to do it by themselves. However if I was in this type of situation, I probably wouldn't have to "fool myself" at all. Not all of us here are atheists.

longtail

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Re: Friends of Bill Z.
« Reply #2 on: December 05, 2016, 07:43:47 PM »
  It did occur to me that even if one is an atheist, the "higher power" can be your own higher self.  I'm not firmly attached to an opinion on this one... really just wanted to kick the idea around a bit.
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Alchemist16AD

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Re: Friends of Bill Z.
« Reply #3 on: December 05, 2016, 09:19:59 PM »
  It did occur to me that even if one is an atheist, the "higher power" can be your own higher self.  I'm not firmly attached to an opinion on this one... really just wanted to kick the idea around a bit.

I am happy to not have had to deal with addiction. However I found a AAA or kind of AAA on face book that was Atheist based. I knew a wiccan who use to go to a pagan like 12 step. They split up the sex's. Girls had to find there inner Goddess boys, their inner god. I think maybe there should be satanic help groups.  Why not?
Forged from wisdom, crafted from knowledge, a product of intelligence, raised by ignorance and stupidly. -Myself .

samowens84

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Re: Friends of Bill Z.
« Reply #4 on: December 06, 2016, 10:07:25 AM »
I used to go to A.A. and there are several things I had misgivings about. They discourage independent thought for example. "Your best thinking got me here" or "smart people don't make it" or someone will share about what thinking for themselves got them. There are a few things satanic that could translate into aa like avoiding self delusion and self accountability. The God thing is big down south too. They'll say things like "get God or get drunk" or that you're powerless over people places and things (not true in my experience.) People live in the binary in AA. Either you're selfish or selfless, or you're all powerful or powerless, there isn't much room for a third way in aa. Incidently I'm still sober, but I think I've submitted my resignation lol.

longtail

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Re: Friends of Bill Z.
« Reply #5 on: February 18, 2017, 03:02:29 PM »
    I like a beer now and then, but it seems to be becoming less often as time goes by. I don't think alcohol was ever really a problem for me... I'm finding that as I meditate more, and work towards greater creative output, that I have less tolerance for my mind being cluttered up after drinking even one beer. Seems like it affects dreamwork, as well. Perhaps it is so, that when you have a different focus than just killing time, that those habits are simply forgotten in one's excitement at current activities. Maybe participating in a group whose focus is the thing you'd rather change about yourself is counterproductive? Admittedly, I'm an odd duck, so I would be the last person to try to press my own methods on someone else.
Joyfully, Non Serviam

Lilith201

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Re: Friends of Bill Z.
« Reply #6 on: February 19, 2017, 07:41:29 AM »
I once had the experience of having to accompany a girlfriend to court ordered 12 step meetings.  What I learned from this is that American addict culture subscribes to the notion that addicts are powerless against their addiction without the intervention of a "higher power", and that our judiciary feels it is ok to order you to go to a religious meeting once you get involved in our legal system over drugs or alcohol. ( Sitting in court observing, one day, I did see a man simply tell the judge he'd rather do the jail time and be done with it, so as not to have to keep reporting to a court appointed officer about meeting attendance; I felt a certain respect for this attitude. )
   I myself was addicted to opioid analgesics for some years, although I managed to avoid the legal system.  I was able to quit with help from a doctor, and a lot of disgust for something that put me at the mercy of unscrupulous dealers; pride and wrath got me clean, not an imaginary friend. I don't believe in  the "once an addict, always an addict" line, nor that addiction is any excuse for other criminal behaviour such as stealing. Now, I still enjoy brewing and drinking beer... for the most part, I consume this in reasonable quantities, and don't seem to have any inclination to let it rule me.
   So I had a random thought, "what would a Satanic substance abuse group look like?"  Perhaps the very idea of addiction is anti-Satanic? Yet humans do have the tendency to seek pleasure in many and various ways, some of which may result in individuals feeling that they have an issue overdoing something, and that they need help or support to escape it. Peer pressure can be a useful tool! Perhaps a virtual place like an IRC channel... "the Bill Z. Pub" . *Grin*
    Anyway, I'm not really proposing to start something like this, I'm mostly just curious about other people's thoughts on the topic, and wanted to kick this idea around a bit. 
 
There is a group called Rational Recovery or Smart Recovery that is designed for atheists.
"Ain't no burning hell."--John Lee Hooker

longtail

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Re: Friends of Bill Z.
« Reply #7 on: March 18, 2017, 05:14:08 PM »
I wonder if a court would recognize that as an option?  Probably depend on the judge, and their mood that day...  still, good to know there are some options for those who need them.
Joyfully, Non Serviam